‘Fargo’s Noah Hawley Explains Why Chris Rock Was the Only Choice for Season 4

Ever since David Thewlis haunted us all with his capitalistic binge eating in 2017, Fargo‘s creator Noah Hawley has maintained that he wouldn’t touch the series again unless he had good reason to do so. Now, in 2020, he does.

At the Television Critics Association’s 2020 winter tour Hawley spoke to Decider about why Year 4’s story about feuding mob families was what drew him back to the warped universe the Coen brothers first created. The showrunner, director, and author also revealed why Chris Rock was essential to this new season and the inherently female identity of this universe hiding beneath all the blood spatter.

Decider: In the past you said you’d only do a fourth installment of Fargo if a story spoke to you. Why is this the story?

Noah Hawley: Because it did like literally speak to me. You know, it’s always, I’m waiting for the idea on some level, whether it’s two men meet in an emergency room or a woman drives home with a guy sticking out of her windshield or two brothers and a stamp collection and a Corvette. There’s always a moment where it’s, “Oh yeah. That feels like Fargo to me.”

For this one it was the idea of two criminal organizations where the bosses trade their youngest sons in order to keep the peace, and I thought, “Oh that’s really interesting.” Not just as comedic, dramatic potential for a story but also as a kind of way into looking at — Fargo is always a story about Americans. The particular wiring of Americans where you end up with a Bill Macy or you end up with a Frances McDormand or a Steve Buscemi. Those are three versions of America right there. So it’s these Italians over from Italy and these African Americans are from the South, and everyone is sort of fighting for a piece of the action because they’re not allowed into the mainstream economy. So then I was like, “Yeah, I guess we have to do that. I guess we’ll make another one.”

FX is happy to hear it but they don’t pressure me. It’s not like they’re going “Where’s our Fargo?” They’re always really thrilled. I mean, that said who knows? By the time I finish I’m always just, I’m empty. That’s everything I have.

Was Chris Rock always the person you had in mind to lead this season?

Yeah. Before when it was just the conceit and I was like “OK, so it’s this Italian family and then this African American family,” I just saw Chris’ face. I didn’t write a list, I didn’t do a thing, I just was like, “It should be Chris Rock.”

I called Chris, and Chris came down to the set of Lucy [in the Sky]. I sort of said here’s who you would be and here’s the set up, and he was like “Great. I’m in.” He liked Fargo. And then it was four or five months before there was a script for him. Luckily he liked it, and we kept going. There was no casting process. It was just like here’s the guy, here’s the actor. Just like when I cast Andrew Bird. I wasn’t like “This guy looks like a 1950s undertaker.” But there’s a quality that Andrew had and that Chris had that was just the character for me.

There’s always an edge of humor to Fargo along with with all the drama and blood. Do you ever keep in mind comedic actors when you’re thinking about casting?

I like to cast comedic personas in dramatic roles and vice versa. You know I loved Nick Offerman in that role that he had…

And Keegan-Michael Key, and Jordan Peele.

Those guys were great. And of course Saul Goodman, my friend. [Bob Odenkirk] thought he was just going to be the comic relief, and he turned out to be the moral heart of the show. That’s exciting to me to do that. And I feel like part of what excited the cast when they come to work on my things in general is the range of things they get to play. Mary [Elizabeth] Winstead, she’s not just one thing. She’s playing comedy, drama. She’s playing action. She’s outsmarting people.

I mean, I saw David Thewlis in Toronto when I was launching Lucy. He had a horrible couple of years after [Season 3] because he just kept rejecting everything because he was like “When are you gonna get a role like that again?”

I mean, there’s no role like V. M. Varga that that even exists anywhere else.

Yeah, yeah. I mean Chris just said “I’m 55. I’ll probably never get a role this good again.” And Bokeem [Woodbine]. He was so good. And you go why hasn’t he, you know? It’s just that there aren’t that many roles that offer you a dynamic tone, suspense and all that. I’m really proud that I can offer those to actors.

That kind of speaks to the core of Fargo. The original movie was about a pregnant police chief with very everyman kind of casting and characters.

I always say that Fargo is the story of basically decent people being dropped on their head. You worry about those people. I don’t worry about Robert Downey Jr. as Iron Man. I’m not really worried about him. But Patrick Wilson or Allison Tolman or Carrie Coon I’m like, “I don’t know if they’re up for this.” Who could be up for Lorne Malvo or V. M. Varga? Those guys will eat you for breakfast.

One of my favorite moments ever in anything I’ve ever done is when Thewlis is facing Mary Winstead and he calls her an amateur and she says professional because she’s semi-professional bridge league player. And she’s outsmarted him. There’s no feeling of victory like the underdog feeling of victory. It’s a hard thing to accomplish anymore but if you can it’s really exhilarating.

I love that pairing of V. M. Varga and Nikki Swango. He’s just pure evil and she’s this agent of chaos.

And he underestimates her, you know? As everyone else does too, and that’s really thrilling. Part of it for me is the identity of Fargo is female. Because of Frances McDormand and Allison Tolman and Carrie Coon and Mary and Kirsten [Dunst]. And so in this season Ethelrida’s character [played by Emyri Crutchfield] and Jessie Buckley [who plays Oraetta Mayflower]. You can’t forget that there’s something about Fargo that is inherently female in a way that needs to be explored. It’s a very guy-heavy season, and yet I think the women of the story are once again very iconic and hopefully unexpected.

Speaking to your career as a whole, you’ve done the miniseries thing with Fargo for a while. You broke the superhero mold with Legion, and with Lucy in the Sky you played in the movie realm. What do you want to explore next?

Well I have this little Star Trek thing that apparently people like. I’ve got a book to finish. There’s sort of no shortage. I assume at some point I’ll run out of stories to tell but luckily I haven’t yet.

I like the idea of trying to make something both big and fun and commercial but also sort of subversively about something and character-driven and — again — that sort of underdog feeling. I don’t find action interesting unless it’s story. I watch The Raid every year. It’s like this guy’s got to fight his way out of a building. That’s the story. So every fight is vital to the success of the story. If it’s just like “Now there’s a set piece and now there’s another set piece…” But at the same time can you create a big commercial story that is challenging and exciting? I’ve always felt like if you entertain people they give you permission to do more, more with themes or characters. Not in an eat your vegetables kind of way

They trust you.

Yeah. I rewatched a couple of the William Shatner Star Trek movies, and they’re really powerful and emotional and triumphant. And adult. You know the one where the Klingon Empire is collapsing and they have to negotiate their way out? It’s intrigue and it feels like an adult drama but at the same time it has all of the best elements of science fiction. So I want to do that. That sounds good to me.

I know you’re very, very passionate about Legion as a character. Are there any other Marvel heroes or villains that you’re interested in adapting?

I mean I wrote a Doctor Doom script for my friends at Marvel, and they have my number. If they want to make it, I think it’s pretty damn good so I’d be excited to do it. But I also know they have a real plan, clearly, that’s working really well for them. So I’m not saying I’m smarter at all. I’m just saying I’ve got a fun one we could do.

Season 4 of Fargo premieres on FX on Sunday, April 19. Episodes will be available on Hulu a day after they air on FX.

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