The Law Show

BBC Radio 4
Weekly conversation that will give you an in-depth understanding of the law stories making news and the legal decisions that could have a bearing on everyone in the UK. Whether it's unpicking a landmark legal ruling, explaining how laws are made or seeking clarity for you on a legal issue, The Law Show will be your guide.

All Episodes

Weekly conversation led by Dr Joelle Grogan to give you an in-depth understanding of the law stories making news and the legal decisions that could have a bearing on everyone in the UK. This week: Traumatised jurors: new research has found that as much as half of people who serve on the juries of gruesome criminal trials, such as child murders or rape, can suffer symptoms of vicarious psychological trauma as a result. A pilot scheme to offer free counselling to affected jurors has now been shelved in England and Wales due to the election. But in Scotland and Northern Ireland support is available. Joelle discusses all this and what else happens on jury service with criminal defence barrister and part-time judge Charlie Sherrard KC, and with author, commentator and barrister Dr Sam Fowles. Prenuptial contracts: what is a "prenup," as they're often called? Should you get one even if you're not wealthy? Are they legally binding in the case of divorce, or not worth the paper they're written on? What do you need to do for the courts to uphold them in the various parts of the UK? Family law solicitor and social media's "legal queen" Tracey Moloney has the answers. And: Japanese knotweed, a fast-growing invasive species so tough it can only be successfully removed by professionals. A Scottish couple has been granted permission by an Edinburgh sheriff to sue the previous owners of their home, who had not declared that there is Japanese knotweed on the property. This case centres around whether or not it counts as an "infestation". Other home seller packs ask about knotweed explicitly. Dr Sam Fowles explains the law, and who you can sue if you find yourself with unwanted knotweed after all. Presenter: Dr Joelle Grogan Producers: Ravi Naik and Arlene Gregorius Editor: Tara McDermott Production co-ordinator: Maria Ogundele

Jun 14

28 min 9 sec

Weekly conversation led by Dr Joelle Grogan about the law stories making the news and the legal decisions that could have a bearing on everyone in the UK. Whether it’s explaining a new law or seeking clarity for you on a legal issue, The Law Show will be your guide.This week:Water: from the cryptosporidium outbreak in tap water in Devon, to E. coli bacteria in the Thames, and sewage in rivers, lakes and seas across the country - what does the law say about clean water? What obligations do water companies have, who enforces this, and who keeps an eye on the enforcers? Do we have a right to clean water to drink or swim in? Joelle explores all this and more with Angus Evers, Partner and Head of Environment Law at Shoosmiths, and with Dr Charlotte Proudman, a barrister and academic. Divorce: in England and Wales, the only divorce available now is no-fault divorce, as a result of a law change that came into force last year. As family law solicitor Tracey Moloney points out though, you also need to get a financial order. If not, your ties haven't been fully severed, and your ex-spouse could make a financial claim in future. In Scotland, you need to prove irretrievable breakdown of the marriage to get a divorce, or that one of you is applying for a gender recognition certificate. In Northern Ireland, you need to cite reasons like adultery, unreasonable behaviour or desertion. And: the Leasehold and Freehold Reform Act 2024 was the last bill that became law just before parliament was dissolved for the general election. Under the Act, which covers England and Wales, leaseholders will gain more rights. For example, it will become easier and cheaper for them to buy their freehold, or extend leases to 990 years. There is also a ban on the sale of all new leasehold houses. But, the Act didn't cap, let alone abolish, ground rent, and hasn't come into force yet...Producers: Ravi Naik and Arlene Gregorius Editor: Tara McDermott Production Co-ordinator: Maria Ogundele

Jun 5

28 min 44 sec

Weekly conversation led by Dr Joelle Grogan about the law stories making the news and the legal decisions that could have a bearing on everyone in the UK. Whether it’s unpicking a landmark legal ruling, explaining how laws are made or seeking clarity for you on a legal issue, The Law Show will be your guide.This week:Assisted dying. Jersey, the Isle of Man, and Scotland are all taking steps towards making it legal to help someone die, in very specific and limited circumstances. It's currently a crime punishable by 14 years' imprisonment in England, Wales and Northern Ireland. Dr Joelle Grogan is joined by Professor Emily Jackson of the LSE, a specialist in medical law, and by barrister Dr Charlotte Proudman to navigate the law around assisted dying and to explain the differences between assisted suicide and euthanasia. Is there a point to county court judgements if they can't be enforced? Social media's "legal queen", solicitor Tracey Maloney, answers a question from a listener, who got a county court judgment against a builder, but still hasn't got her money back. Art or evidence? Drill music, with its sometimes violent-sounding words, has been used by the prosecution in criminal trials to help paint a picture of the defendants as gang members. But is it fair to claim lyrics like "try deadin' him" are proof of criminal intent, or are these words just fiction? Senior criminal barrister and co-founder of the "Art not Evidence" campaign Keir Monteith KC argues that drill is being used unfairly against Black boys and young men. The Crown Prosecution Service insists that they “would not use this evidence if it was not relevant.”And a listener asks: is it legal to sunbathe naked in your garden? Producers: Ravi Naik and Arlene Gregorius Editor: Tara McDermott Production co-ordinator: Maria Ogundele

May 29

28 min 29 sec

Weekly conversation led by Dr Joelle Grogan that gives you an in-depth understanding of the law stories making the news and the legal decisions that could have a bearing on everyone in the UK. Whether it’s unpicking a landmark legal ruling, explaining how laws are made or seeking clarity for you on a legal issue, The Law Show will be your guide.This week: Protest law has been tightened up a lot in the last year, giving the police more leeway to stop disruption. But parts of the new powers have now been deemed unlawful by the High Court. So what is and isn't legal when it comes to protest? And how should the police handle protesters? Joelle explores all this with barrister Dr Sam Fowles and with Andy Walker from the College of Policing.Is it legal to build on greenbelt land? Campaigners in Greater Manchester are taking legal action after Bury council announced plans to build 1500 homes on greenbelt.And: why you may need a "Lasting Power of Attorney", even if you're married. If your spouse were to be incapacitated, being next of kin is not enough to make financial or health decisions about them. Social media's "legal queen", solicitor Tracey Maloney, talks us through how and when to get an LPA. Producers: Ravi Naik and Arlene Gregorius Editor: Tara McDermott Production coordinator: Maria Ogundele

May 22

27 min 43 sec

It’s a practical guide to navigating the law. Each week Joelle will be joined by a family of experts to offer in-depth understanding of the legal issues making the headlines, and explain how they affect us. Whether it’s unpicking a landmark legal ruling, explaining how laws are made or seeking clarity for you on a legal issue, The Law Show will be your guide.

May 21

57 sec

Dame Sue Carr, Baroness Carr of Walton-on-the-Hill, is the first Lady Chief Justice, the first woman to hold the role. She gives her first broadcast interview as head of the judiciary of England and Wales to Law in Action, for its farewell edition. She speaks about her priorities, hopes, and concerns, and marks the end of Law in Action by looking back at 40 years in the law. She also picks her favourite editions of the programme, and closes with a tribute to presenter Joshua Rozenberg. Lord David Pannick KC is widely regarded as the most successful lawyer of his generation practising in his chosen area of the law, public law. Things might have turned out differently though: he had been approached to host Law in Action originally, and presented the pilot edition of the programme, produced by Joshua. He too looks back over the last 40 years and finds that much has changed in court. We then look ahead to the future, and the next generation of those grappling with the law: we join 15-year old GCSE students at Trinity Academy in Brixton, south London, as they are taught The Big Legal Lesson - as part of a campaign by the charity Young Citizens. What do they make of the law? Presenter: Joshua Rozenberg Producer: Arlene Gregorius Researcher: Diane Richardson Production Coordinator: Katie Morrison Editor: Clare Fordham

Mar 26

28 min 59 sec

Following a Court of Appeal ruling this week about a case referred to the senior judges by the Attorney General, those charged with criminal damage for actions like throwing red paint at a building as a protest, can no longer use a certain defence to be acquitted. Parliament had intended the defence for different circumstances. Protesters used to be able to claim that had the owners of the damaged property known of the reasons for the damage, such as to highlight climate change, they'd have agreed to it. The Attorney General, Victoria Prentis KC MP speaks exclusively to Joshua Rozenberg about what this victory means. Prisons are almost full, and to help make room, the Justice Secretary Alex Chalk KC MP has announced that prisoners meeting certain criteria can be released up to two months early. Prison campaigners must be pleased, or are they? Andrea Coomber KC (hon), chief executive of the Howard League for Penal Reform, has a more mixed reaction. How are prisons in England and Wales dealing with inmates with severe mental health needs? Independent Monitoring Boards (IMB), which are often called the eyes and ears of the public in prison, believe that too often prisons rely upon tough segregation units to manage inmates with mental health needs. IMB volunteers share their observations, and Elisabeth Davies, IMB National Chair, calls for a faster transfer to secure hospital units instead. Awaab Ishak was aged just two when he died as a direct result of exposure to mould in the home his family rented from Rochdale Boroughwide Housing. The coroner issued a Prevention of Future Deaths report as a result, but it was only following a campaign by Awaab's parents and others that the law was changed. Awaab's Law, as it's being called, will specify the timeframes within which social landlords have to respond to complaints of mould. We hear from barrister Christian Weaver of Garden Court North, who represented Awaab's family.Presenter: Joshua Rozenberg Producer: Arlene Gregorius Researcher: Diane Richardson Editor: Clare Fordham Production coordinator: Katie Morrison

Mar 19

28 min 47 sec

How do we prevent young people from becoming involved in knife crime? Joshua speaks to 'Jay' who began carrying a knife in his early teens before being helped to change his perspective, and his life.We explore the link between school exclusions and crime, and hear that workshops using graphic evidence to deter young people from carrying a knife can be counterproductive. We also find out about innovative policing methods to deter young people from carrying knives, or, if they've been caught already, try and get them back onto the right track without prosecuting them in court or sending them to prison. Can treatments like cognitive behavioural therapy and mentoring, as well as help with education or employment, help young people turn their lives round?Contributors: 'Jay' who carried knives as a young person Robin Lockhart, Director of Development, Catalyst in Communities Dr Charlotte Coleman, Deputy Head of Psychology, Sheffield Hallam University Aika Stephenson, Co-Founder and Legal Director, Just for Kids Law Dr Peter Neyroud, Associate Professor, Cambridge University Institute of Criminology Bruce Houlder KC, founder, Fighting Knife Crime LondonProducer: Arlene Gregorius Researchers: Marianna Brain and Diane Richardson Editor: Tara McDermott Production Coordinator: Katie Morrison

Mar 12

28 min 57 sec

The Post Office scandal is one of the UK's most widespread miscarriages of justice, with hundreds of people wrongfully convicted of theft or false accounting. In most of these cases, the Post Office was the investigator, prosecutor and the alleged victim.Did Post Office lawyers act unethically by failing to disclose evidence that might have helped the people they were prosecuting? Might they face criminal proceedings for attempting to pervert the course of justice?The Post Office no longer brings private prosecutions in cases such as this. But should we still be allowing anyone apart from a public prosecutor to bring criminal proceedings in the name of the state?Presenter: Joshua Rozenberg Producers: Arlene Gregorius and Diane Richardson Researcher: Marianna Brain Editor: Clare Fordham Production coordinator: Maria Ogundele Sound engineer: Neil Churchill

Mar 5

29 min

Can juries acquit a defendant as a matter of conscience? For example, if people are accused of causing criminal damage as part of a protest, could the jury find them innocent despite the judge's directions? Joshua speaks to Clive Dolphin from Defend our Juries; Richard Vogler, Professor of Comparative Criminal Law & Criminal Justice, University of Sussex, and Tana Adkin KC, Chair of the Criminal Bar Association.There are currently around 5000 active satellites in space and that's expected to rise to 100,000 by 2030. Satellites generate debris, too, and even a tiny fleck of paint can cause serious damage when colliding with something else, due to the speeds involved. But who is liable if one satellite damages another? Joshua asks Rachael O'Grady, Partner at Mayer Brown if international space law is keeping up with technology.If you find treasure in Scotland, can you keep it and will the finder receive a reward for declaring it? We hear from Glasgow University student Lucy Ankers who discovered a hoard of coins thought to be linked to the 1692 Glencoe massacre and Bobby Sandeman, Chief Executive of King's and Lord Treasurer's Remembrancer.Presenter: Joshua Rozenberg Producers: Diane Richardson and Arlene Gregorius Sound: Graham Puddifoot and James Beard Editor: Carl Johnston

Nov 2023

28 min 41 sec

What if someone uses AI to create a fake version of your voice for their own aims? Recently, the actor, broadcaster and writer Stephen Fry found that someone had recreated his voice to narrate a documentary without his knowledge. What does the law have to say about deepfakes? What are your rights, and in which circumstances could someone be sued, or prosecuted? Associate solicitor Oliver Lock of Farrer & Co explains what the law can, and can't do. Creating fakes with AI, and the software to detect them, is a growing field. The same is true of forensic speech recognition, which is done both by ear and machine and can help the police or a court identify whether a recording is the voice of a suspect, for example. Dr Anil Alexander of Oxford Wave Research Ltd plays some samples to presenter Joshua Rozenberg. Can he guess them right? And what other uses are there for this technology in law enforcement?Forensic scientists are often called upon to give evidence in court, as are doctors. These expert witnesses are crucial, but things can go wrong. Some find cross-examination so bruising that they don't want to repeat it. Others fear for their reputation, if they're pushed into saying something they hadn't meant to say. Baroness Professor Sue Black is a leading forensic anthropologist and shares her thoughts.Sometimes barristers and judges are out of their depth on the science of a case. One solution to this problem has been put forward by the independent scientific academy the Royal Society, with the Royal Society of Edinburgh: subject-specific primers on relevant topics. As Dame Dr Julie Maxton, executive director of the Royal Society explains, leading scientists write and peer-review the primers, such as on ballistics or DNA, and senior judges cross-check them from the legal perspective. The primers are online, aimed at judges but available for everyone. The hope is that if barristers fail to ask the right questions on the science, judges who've read the primers can then do so instead. Presenter: Joshua Rozenberg Producer: Arlene Gregorius Researcher: Diane Richardson Editor: Clare Fordham Sound engineers: James Beard and Rod Farquhar Production Coordinators: Maria Ogundele and Rosie Strawbridge

Nov 2023

28 min 42 sec

Last week, the House of Commons Justice Select Committee published a wide-ranging report about sentencing and public opinion. On the one hand, it said we shouldn't ignore what people think. On the other hand, MPs found that many people didn’t understand how sentencing worked. The justice committee's own research confirmed this lack of understanding. The committee's chair, the Conservative MP Sir Bob Neill, also points out the cost of longer sentences: £47,000 per prisoner per year.Despite that level of expenditure, all is not well in the prisons of England & Wales. Self-harm, suicide and assault rates are all up. Prison officers are "voting with their feet," says Professor Alison Liebling, director of the Prisons Research Centre of Cambridge University's Institute of Criminology. She has been doing research in prisons for nearly 35 years, and thinks that this is "the most unstable, and unsafe period [she's] known". But she also has some suggestions for how to improve matters, and to free up prison spaces.There's been yet another mass shooting in the United States, again involving a military-style assault weapon. Rather than try for tighter gun control to stop these killings, some people are taking the gun manufacturers to court instead. Chicago-based lawyer Antonio Romanucci is acting for many of those affected by a shooting in Chicago on Independence Day last year. They're bringing a civil claim under consumer marketing laws. Could it be successful?The Scottish government is planning to give the people of Scotland new, enforceable human rights. These would largely be economic, social and cultural rights, as opposed to the current civil and political ones like freedom of speech. The plan is to incorporate several international treaties into Scottish law. The UK is a signatory to these treaties already, but the rights they proclaim can't be enforced through the courts. A new Human Rights bill in Scotland would change that. But could it avoid being scuppered by the limits of devolution?Presenter: Joshua Rozenberg Producer: Arlene Gregorius Researcher: Diane Richardson Production Coordinator: Maria Ogundele Sound engineers: Neil Churchill and Graham Puddifoot

Oct 2023

28 min 49 sec