When Meghan Markle and Prince Harry spoke to Oprah Winfrey in March 2021, they broke so many unofficial palace rules that it was easy to overlook one of the couple’s most telling moves: Meghan called the palace institution “the Firm.” For Meghan, it was a way of emphasizing how difficult their relationships with palace courtiers had become. For the family at large, it’s the way they express that being a royal is partially about your family ties and partially about working for an institution with a pivotal role in Britain.

In this episode of DYNASTY: The Windsors, cohosts Katie Nicholl and Erin Vanderhoof speak to a handful of guests who can explain what the palace is really like from the inside. Patrick Jephson, Princess Diana’s longtime private secretary, explains just how much effort really goes into a royal’s day-to-day tasks. Historian Robert Hazell discusses the palace’s internal functions and what we really mean when we say that only some of the Windsors are “working royals.” Finally, investment banker Euan Rellie gives a bit of insight into the family’s finances and how the royals balance their love of finery with their sense of thrift.

Theoretically, the royals and their staffers are all working toward a common goal: making the monarchy look good. But some of the most discordant stories in the press have emerged from the moments when the family members and their various staff haven’t been on the same page. Is there any way for harmony to be maintained when your grandmother is also your boss?

Listen to the episode in the player above, and don’t forget to tune in next Tuesday, June 14, when DYNASTY: The Windsors returns with an episode about the biggest scandal the crown has seen in decades: the aftermath of Prince Andrew’s friendship with Jeffrey Epstein. Subscribe at listen.vanityfair.com/dynasty or wherever you get your podcasts.