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MANOUSH ZOMORODI, HOST:
OK. This is the beginning of BODY ELECTRIC Season 2. This is our investigation into - oh, my God - the ways that our technology impacts our health. And one of the things we are doing this season is we are taking five-minute walks with notables, with listeners because in Season 1, we learned that, really, the only way to counteract our screen-filled, sedentary lives is to take regular - and when I say regular, I mean really regular - movement breaks.
And so I am joined for this first walking episode - five minutes, Kelly. That's it. Kelly Corrigan - my friend and the host of PBS' "State Of Well-Being In America." We're in Vancouver. It's beautiful. Kelly, thank you for walking with me.
KELLY CORRIGAN: Sure, any time. I'd like to walk with you more frequently.
ZOMORODI: I would, too. So this...
CORRIGAN: OK.
ZOMORODI: ...Is a good start.
CORRIGAN: OK.
ZOMORODI: Question for you - "State Of Well-Being In America." That's a big question.
CORRIGAN: Yes.
ZOMORODI: What is the state of well-being in America?
CORRIGAN: So each season, we ask a big question, like, what is well-being? And what does it take to get it? And what does it take to keep it? And so we talked to 10 of the best scientists and researchers in the United States.
ZOMORODI: Oh, should we get out of the bike lane?
CORRIGAN: Yes. It's always good to walk carefully when walking...
ZOMORODI: (Laughter).
CORRIGAN: ...Manoush. But, I mean, here we are. There's, like, seaplanes and strollers and...
ZOMORODI: It's...
CORRIGAN: ...Puppies and...
ZOMORODI: ...Pretty spectacular.
CORRIGAN: It's pretty spectacular. That gigantic sound is a seaplane.
ZOMORODI: And Vancouver - they take their well-being quite seriously. But please...
CORRIGAN: They do. They do. Well, I mean, so what we were trying to do is separate, like, real science from pop science. And then to make it more grounded in the real and diverse lives of others, we asked two civilians to join us in each conversation. And so we asked you...
ZOMORODI: I'm in one of those episodes.
CORRIGAN: ...To come...
ZOMORODI: Yes.
CORRIGAN: ...And talk about movement because I was aware of the BODY ELECTRIC stuff. And you have completely persuaded me that I need to stand up every 30 minutes and sway.
ZOMORODI: Yay.
CORRIGAN: And it's totally effective. I mean, I...
ZOMORODI: It is, right?
CORRIGAN: It's the dumbest...
ZOMORODI: So dumb.
CORRIGAN: ...Simplest...
ZOMORODI: (Laughter).
CORRIGAN: ...Like, most banal advice.
ZOMORODI: Just...
CORRIGAN: But it - we weren't meant to be sitting all day.
ZOMORODI: No.
CORRIGAN: And so there's just going to be the consequences to, like, working against the machinery's orders.
ZOMORODI: OK. So let's talk about you. You're a writer. Like, that is your main thing. That's how I first became aware of your work. You do writing. And so take me through a day where you try to have habits that makes it possible for you to work and also, please, listen to your body a little bit.
CORRIGAN: Yeah. So I feel like I'm constantly gut-checking with smart friends who can help me put a finer point on things. And so an easy way for me to merge my own well-being with my career is to walk and talk as much as possible.
ZOMORODI: And what about for your five-minute breaks? Like, are you getting up and shuffling...
CORRIGAN: A little dance.
ZOMORODI: ...Side to - little dance. That's your thing?
CORRIGAN: A little dance, Manoush.
ZOMORODI: Yeah.
CORRIGAN: Little dance.
ZOMORODI: A little dance.
CORRIGAN: I mean, I love music so much. I think it's the cheapest way to change your mood. And sometimes...
ZOMORODI: (Laughter).
CORRIGAN: ...I forget. You know, sometimes I'm, like, in a sour mood, or I'm so tired. I feel like I - oh, my God. I don't have one sentence left in me. And then I think, no, no. Don't forget music. Turn on music. And then it makes me want to kind of, like, clean the dishes or something, like, make something look a little nicer around me - clear off my desk, take the recycling out. You know, it's, like, three minutes or four minutes where...
ZOMORODI: But that...
CORRIGAN: ...There's some measurable improvement.
ZOMORODI: That little voice that you just described, the one that's like, I don't want to.
CORRIGAN: Totally.
ZOMORODI: I just want to keep doing what I'm doing. I don't feel like getting up. I don't feel like moving.
CORRIGAN: I don't want to do anything.
ZOMORODI: Yes.
CORRIGAN: There's a lot of, I don't want to do anything. There's got to be two or three hours a day where I think, I just don't have it in me. I'm done. I'm - I wake up early. I'm 56. I wake up at 5:30, 6 o'clock. I go to work. And at 1 o'clock, I have nothing.
ZOMORODI: You're just dead.
CORRIGAN: I mean, don't schedule any calls from 1 to 3, you know?
ZOMORODI: That's it. You're aware of your limits, it sounds like.
CORRIGAN: Totally. And I work in spurts. I mean, this is the joy of being old is that I don't fight with myself anymore about how I work and what my sort of periods of rest look like. And, like, I'm horizontal - from 1 to 3, I'm horizontal under a blanket.
ZOMORODI: And that's OK that you're not taking your five-minute walks every...
CORRIGAN: No.
ZOMORODI: ...Half hour.
CORRIGAN: I'm listening to something, or I'm watching a talk, or - you know, whatever it is. And that's slow productivity. It's passive productivity. But nonetheless, it's, like, moving a needle.
ZOMORODI: If we had to sum up the lessons from this five-minute walk - of which I think there are many - I would say, listen to your body. Know when you work best. Learn how to use your vices (laughter) to your benefit.
CORRIGAN: Yes. Yes.
ZOMORODI: Any others?
CORRIGAN: Embrace the idiosyncratic way that you work.
ZOMORODI: Ah. Yes. Let's leave it there. I think we're at five minutes.
CORRIGAN: Fantastic.
ZOMORODI: Thanks, Kelly.
CORRIGAN: Nice talking to you. Bye.
ZOMORODI: Bye.
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